Episodes

Episode 3 – Reach Higher: How Climbing is Transforming Life with Parkinson’s

What would you say if someone suggested you go climbing to help manage your Parkinson’s? Probably the same thing as the group of over-70s who looked at Natalia Kaminska like she was completely mad. But then they tried it, and something remarkable happened.

In this episode, Maria and Vicky are joined by two people who believe climbing might be one of the best exercises available for people living with Parkinson’s. Natalia is a specialist neurological physiotherapist based in Leeds who has been running climbing sessions for people with Parkinson’s, supported by Parkinson’s UK. Jordi Cruz is a physiotherapist, paraclimbing competitor and founder of the Dreaming Awake Project, diagnosed with young-onset Parkinson’s at 39 and climbing ever since. Joining Jordi is his wife, Rebeca, who kindly translated throughout the conversation.

Together, they make a compelling case. Climbing hits almost every recommendation for Parkinson’s-specific exercise in one go: big movements, coordination, balance, strength, and an intense focus that demands you stay completely in the moment. As Jordi puts it, when you’re on the wall, you simply can’t think about anything else. But beyond the physical benefits, there’s something else entirely: the community, the sense of belonging, and the joy of achieving something you never thought possible.

Jordi also shares his research into velocity training and how training fast, even at low intensity, can help address bradykinesia, the slowness of movement that affects every person with Parkinson’s. And Natalia shares the story of a 75-year-old who climbed for the first time and cried, because his family had told him he couldn’t do it.

As Rebeca puts it on Jordi’s behalf: when you get lemons, make lemonade. This episode is full of it.

About Our Guests

Natalia Kaminska is a Specialist Neurological Physiotherapist with a strong background in rehabilitation, including her role as Parkinson’s Service Lead. She is passionate about helping people with Parkinson’s stay active and reconnect with meaningful activities. As a qualified climbing instructor, Natalia supports individuals with Parkinson’s to access climbing safely, whether returning to a previous hobby or trying something new. Her personalised, evidence-based approach focuses on building confidence, strength, and independence through tailored support.

Jordi Cruz is a physiotherapist, climber, author, and founder of the Dreaming Awake Project. Diagnosed with young-onset Parkinson’s at 39, he transformed adversity into purpose, becoming an international paraclimbing competitor, researcher, and advocate for movement as a tool for dignity, resilience, and connection. Through Dreaming Awake, Jordi is building an inclusive movement that brings together climbing, outdoor sports, science, and community for people living with Parkinson’s. His mission is simple: to prove that a diagnosis does not define who you are, and that there is still life — real life — to be lived, climbed, and dreamed awake.

Useful Links & Resources

Timecodes

  • 0:40 — Maria and Vicky catch up: a restaurant with bunk bed tables and a steam train birthday
  • 2:39 — Introducing today’s guests: Jordi Cruz, Rebeca and Natalia Kaminska
  • 3:29 — Natalia and Jordi introduce themselves
  • 4:05 — The chocolate bar question: white chocolate for Jordi, and why
  • 4:44 — Jordi’s climbing journey: started at 22, diagnosed at 39, still climbing at 47
  • 5:53 — How does climbing help your Parkinson’s?
  • 6:13 — Jordi and Rebeca: big movements, balance, coordination and solving a puzzle
  • 6:46 — Natalia: climbing as community, not just sport
  • 7:39 — Maria: climbing fits all Parkinson’s exercise recommendations
  • 8:34 — Total focus on the wall: climbing helps you forget about the disease
  • 9:16 — “Exercise for Parkinson’s is a thinking modality that makes you sweat”
  • 9:35 — Natalia’s climbing community for people with Parkinson’s
  • 10:13 — The over-70s group who’d never climbed before
  • 13:27 — The power of achievement: turning a diagnosis into a positive
  • 14:19 — Jordi’s velocity training: training fast to combat slowness
  • 15:02 — Maria on bradykinesia and why velocity training matters
  • 16:17 — Evidence from the Netherlands: data showing climbing helps
  • 17:27 — How Jordi structures his velocity-based warm-ups
  • 18:35 — Rate of Force Development (RFD) explained
  • 19:21 — Training at 40-60% weight to build velocity safely
  • 19:52 — Natalia: building confidence before introducing faster movements
  • 21:14 — Velocity warm-ups: a practical tip for any training session
  • 21:59 — Two sides to climbing: on the wall and off-wall training
  • 22:40 — Vicky: the cognitive challenge at the heart of good Parkinson’s exercise
  • 24:05 — Knowing when to stop: velocity, repetitions and the linear encoder
  • 25:17 — Understanding individual exercise prescriptions for Parkinson’s
  • 26:14 — Using technology to know when to rest
  • 26:46 — Rest, sleep and recovery: essential, not optional
  • 27:30 — Natalia: rest is important for everyone, especially with Parkinson’s
  • 28:16 — The story of a 75-year-old who climbed for the first time and cried
  • 28:53 — Sense of achievement, community support and joy
  • 29:19 — Vicky: we need this inspiration in the Parkinson’s community
  • 29:54 — Educating families and carers about what’s possible
  • 30:51 — The importance of independence
  • 31:12 — Natalia: climbing is one of the safest interventions available
  • 31:41 — The need for data to establish climbing as a recommended intervention
  • 32:35 — Maria: excited about the possibilities and future research
  • 33:48 — How to get involved in climbing near you
  • 34:58 — Jordi’s group in Spain and Molly Kuka’s 1,000+ community in the US
  • 35:33 — Natalia: happy to chat with anyone interested
  • 36:14 — Maria: every climber I’ve ever met is joyous and optimistic
  • 36:35 — Vicky: I need to find my local wall!
  • 37:25 — Rebeca: when you get lemons, make lemonade
  • 37:51 — Natalia: climbing is for absolutely anybody
  • 39:34 — Maria and Vicky’s reflections and key takeaways
  • 40:21 — Maria’s highlight: velocity, speed of recruitment and future possibilities
  • 41:21 — Teaser for Episode 4: a highly confidential guest — and a BBC invitation

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